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Re: Power Systems and Ratings-A funny thing happened today...


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Author Topic: Re: Power Systems and Ratings-A funny thing happened today...  (Read 846 times)
Senti Onikawa
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« on: October 24, 2013, 10:15:47 pm »

So after some consideration and the like, I realized something; the system for heroes really allows too much abuse with respect to abled, balanced, and strong-willed. Right now my title character is listed as balanced, not at all an issue except his combat skills are retarded OP as far as a single individual goes and while I attribute this to the character itself (and how I designed him) I realized he really doesn't hold up in that category. Obviously he has no CC buffs that protect him mentally so it seems more logical to put him in strong-willed, doesn't it?

I then realized no amount of HP/CC moderation would help balance him in a manner that a mistress COULD fight him 1v1 and on equal terms. I went about nerfing some of his techniques and found him to still be OP. So the question I pose is relevant to all characters, really. Should we be restricted to 1 OP character and make it a rare instance to use that character? Or should the OP characters be admin-only so the regular schmucks can't abuse stun-locks and damage modifiers?
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Ryuforce2
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« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2013, 01:39:02 am »

As the victim of said power. I think this is more or less a case of how you play the characters and how you create them to be fair. There isn't no formula or limitation really outside of what admins say and what other players suggest. If you make an OP hero or Mistress all it does is make people want to avoid facing them and ruins the fun. Especially since you can't use them that often because they wreck so hard. I do agree the changes to health don't really offer much but it's a start and encourages abusing certain stat based paths. (Players investing in nothing but CC? make a Break Mistress)

Another idea is as the creator, think of your counter play. Think on what fair (and preferably fun) weaknesses makes your character balanced.

Examples:

Dark Light and Yula are effective in 1v1 but both hinder greatly in groups. Yula's moves all focus on one target and thus requires her to rely on succubi to distract enemies from stripping her down. Dark Light can be powerful but also stems from the same problem AND hurts any non slaves she has as her auras and 'Submit!' moves effect them as well.

Yona, an old hero I had, at the time was powerful but needs to charge a turn to effectively hit with his moves (made up by the fact it was an incredibly high chance after using the focus move) however this is countered by finding ways to keep him from attacking or doing enough CC damage to break his 'focus'

Over all it's really going to be up to everyone on how moves should be changed and what damages does and so long as you take heed of advice the experience is fun, even if a move may seem a bit too strong. Though the golden rule is still important: When in doubt, probably should nerf.
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Senti Onikawa
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« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2013, 12:02:45 pm »

Quote
Though the golden rule is still important: When in doubt, probably should nerf.

And there is a point where if you nerf too much it starts to become an issue of your character not having a leg to stand on which severely reduces their effectiveness in combat. Right now Senti is nerfed and even has cool-downs applied so he can't spam his moves and end a fight in a ridiculous amount of fashion. He's still OP as all get-out, but that doesn't mean he's undefeatable by any means. Also, SL's hypno ball was pretty OP itself. >_>

On a more serious note though the investment into CC and HP seems to only make that character all the more OP. One of the things I commented on was how Senti couldn't be allowed to attain Elite status since the gain would only to serve to set him at a higher bar than most of the mistresses on the site. The issue here is when you create a decent character with lots of potential and who can handle themselves in 1v1 effectively, the entire thing falls into a power creep. (See: tropes-Power Creep) The problem with a power creep is in most cases is that it occurs in a manner that leaves no doubt as to how "fair" it is to everyone EXCEPT the people who aren't prepared/conscious of it's existence.

One of the major concerns that came up a while back was that a Mistress was too OP to have a fair battle and that if someone was ambitious (and possibly cheeky) they could just stun-lock the mistress and tally up victories like that until they could gain a sufficient enough power bonus to stand toe-to-toe with your average mistress. As a means to counter both problems the application of effects required the range be lowered to an amount that permitted a fair chance to break and that mistresses take a power nerf in terms of HP and (possibly?) range vs damage ratios. I'm not whining nor defending this position but simply using it as an example of how we handled the power creep last time.

So now a hero can essentially power through a single mistress if built properly but at the same time both sides have a fair chance so long as the rolls they throw aren't bad. My concern is whether or not the elite rank is maybe poised too low for a fair balance or if it's meant to create a situation where a single hero could outgun a single mistress at a certain point.
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